Building the Idea House Atop the Status Quo w/ Dave Byer

In this episode of Authenticated, Kate McLeod sits down with Dave Byer for an expansive, deeply human conversation about creativity, change, and the quiet strength of choosing to do things differently.

As Dave reflects on the past year, he traces a personal shift—out of a limiting mindset and into a fuller, more aligned version of himself. Through candid storytelling, he shares how rethinking the status quo, prioritizing accessibility, and building platforms like the JHRTS New York Writers Room have all been part of a bigger desire to leave things better than he found them.

In real time, Kate offers creative reflection and guidance—gently consulting as a co-thinker and mirror—inviting Dave to consider that this moment, this version of himself, is the best place to build from. She introduces the metaphor of constructing an “idea house,” brick by brick, reminding him (and us) that taking meaningful creative action doesn’t require permission—only presence, intention, and belief.

Together, they explore the power of autonomy, the value of process over perfection, and how expansive creative thinking can shift not only projects, but entire mindsets. If you’ve been feeling like you’re between chapters or waiting for a sign to start, this conversation may be exactly what you didn’t know you needed.

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Transcript

Kate McLeod: [00:00:00] really quickly? Can you hear this?

Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: Badly? 

Dave Byer: Um, I mean, maybe a little softer type. A little softer. It's not 

Kate McLeod: okay. I can hear it though. What if I go this? I can hear though. Sweet. Thank you. I will type without my nails. 

Dave Byer: Can you hear? Can you hear drinking?

Dave Byer: Okay. 

I'll try not to. 

Kate McLeod: I don't care if we hear it or not. 

Dave Byer: Let my mouth dry out too much. 

Kate McLeod: Oh, no, that's really fine. 'cause I'm gonna be doing the same thing, so I'm not too concerned. 

INTRO: Welcome to the latest episode of Authenticated with your host, Kate McLeod. I am intrigued by people, people watching. I love people learning. That's where I'm insatiably curious. I'm interested in the why and how of the creative minds pattern of thinking. The subtext to the creative thinker or in its more conscious and malleable form, the creative conscious.

Because when you are so clear on yourself via the triad of consciousnesses, then you become reflective to others. Meeting yourself [00:01:00] is an infectious practice because what feels good is infectious and something I think we could all use a good dose of. So join me in conversations with a diverse arsenal of creative thinkers, from artists to entrepreneurs, to serial thinkers ready to optimize their creative conscious with me.

Self-made and self-proclaimed creative entrepreneur. Sounds hot, right? 

Kate McLeod: Dave Byer! Welcome to the podcast. 

Dave Byer: Thanks for having me. It's so nice to chat with you. 

Kate McLeod: No, thank you for being here.

Kate McLeod: I'm really excited. Um, so for context, for people who are listening, um, Dave and I met via the Hollywood Radio and Television Society. You are the co-president of our chapter in New York and I am a board member. 

Dave Byer: Yeah, we, uh, I think met for the first time last year at one of our, uh, speed networking events.

Dave Byer: And I feel like in our first conversation we just kinda clicked and mm-hmm. Glad to have you aboard now. 

Kate McLeod: Yeah, I'm having a lot of fun there. I mean, the networking alone is great. The opportunity that exists there is great. I love [00:02:00] collaboration events, all of the above that's happening there. Um, I remember at the speed networking event that we met at, we were talking about programming 'cause I had never met anyone who did programming at a network and I was really excited to learn about what it is that you did,

Kate McLeod: 'cause I didn't even understand at the time that, that was something that people were able to do. 

Dave Byer: Yeah, it's, um, it's an interesting thing. I think it was like hugely important in the early days of TV and in the last 20 years has kind of waned and then come back as a need because of under like, a different guise with curation is, is kind of what they're calling it now.

Dave Byer: When it comes to streamers. It's like programming, curating what people wanna see and knowing their taste and feeding that to them. 

Kate McLeod: Why does the title change? 

Dave Byer: Um, you know, how things with trends go. I think it's, you know, hipper and cooler to use a word like that, or, or I think people also call it like [00:03:00] editorial, uh, for the, for the streamers.

Dave Byer: But it's, it's all basically the same content strategy bucket. So, 

Kate McLeod: so it's just to keep up with the times then when the, when like the name of that changes. 'cause what you did just sounded like the curation of. 

Dave Byer: Yeah, the program, yeah. It was curation for linear and I think, uh, to sound more modern, it's like to differentiate the streaming from the linear.

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. I think there's a little bit of siloing in the industry within those departments, and a lot of people, you know, think that linear is dying and maybe it is. Probably is. Mm-hmm. Uh, so it's, it's a way of, I think, looking more, um, toward the future rather than the past. But that's just my hunch. 

Kate McLeod: I feel like it'd be such a good position for you because I feel like with your really diverse background of what you've been doing in the [00:04:00] industry, it seems like a strength that you have is using your own artistry to concisely put one big idea into a small, digestible hook. You're really good at making hooks for larger works.

Kate McLeod: Mm. Like when you were at, um, I was reading your letter box and I was like, oh, this is, so, I was like, this is good, this is good. When you were at Cover Fly Uhhuh, because that's what you did, right? 

Dave Byer: Yeah. With them I was, um, giving writers script feedback, uh, to try to make their work better. And it's, it's, um, like I've given coverage at, at corporate jobs before too.

Dave Byer: But this type of coverage was specifically designed to be seen by the writer and used for them to improve their craft and their, uh, script to be better when it's seen by corporate eyes. Whereas if you [00:05:00] write coverage. For a, a company, it's more of a like, what did you like about this? Or dislike about it?

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. 

Dave Byer: And it's less, less constructive. 

Kate McLeod: Wait, so when you're doing that 

Dave Byer: mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: And you're communicating this coverage, in your head, who are you talking to? Are you talking to the consumers or to the creator? 

Dave Byer: Creator. Yeah. That, that's like what I mean about the difference between the two. Like if you're writing coverage at an agency or a production company, uh, you're writing it for the agents and the managers to know whether to consider reading more of a client's work or who to send their work to, whether it's good or bad.

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. And when you're writing it, um, for cover fly, it's going back to the person who wrote it so that they can try to make it better usually. and occasionally. I would write it for like a script contests. Mm-hmm. Uh, and then that one is being read by, you know, whoever the judges [00:06:00] are. 

Kate McLeod: You're saying this and it's clicking with me why AI is a problem in this sector.

Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: But even ai, so like I, I, my thoughts on AI are that like, artificial intelligence can't be operated without intelligence. Mm-hmm. And so like, there has to be a human behind it. Mm-hmm. And even though like AI can be a really great tool and potentially do what it is that you do, I don't think that there is any way to formulate human error.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. And so I don't think there's actually a way to successfully make AI do what you've done. Mm-hmm. But is that what's happening? 

Dave Byer: yeah. I mean, it sounds like AI is kind of leaching into everything, and I'm sure there's, you know, AI coverage places you can go. I haven't actually looked into that, but I, I would agree with you that I, I don't think that would be.

Dave Byer: The best feedback to get, from an ai, at least at this stage, uh, because as we know, they, they are operated by what they've been fed before. So [00:07:00] it really, I think, would close off some of the creativity. If, if an AI was looking at your script, it would probably guide you to be like something else rather than to be like yourself.

Kate McLeod: Yeah, well, because there's an end point. 'cause if it's everything it's been fed, it doesn't have any activation within it, besides people feeding it for it to progress forward. Mm-hmm. Um, I love, I Okay, my, my brain's gone a bunch of different places. Worries. And also I've been very excited for this episode for so long.

Kate McLeod: Um, so I totally took us off at the structure that I told you we were gonna start with. That's cool. So I'm gonna go back to that. So, um, you know that I've been moving into creative consulting as part of what I've been doing, um, which is expanding the creative ideas that anybody else has and making them more you coded or more authentic.

Kate McLeod: So it is what we're talking about. It's anyone who has a creative idea or creative streak, making it bigger, making it more them, therefore more them in the world. And so I think that when things are super clear, it makes room for other [00:08:00] people. And so I wanted to start today out because you are in a big transition period and every time I have seen you recently energetically, I just know a very big thing is happening.

Kate McLeod: Um, I'm gonna figure just in case that's your thing. Um, so I wanna ask in your words today, what is your context as Dave Byer? 

Dave Byer: I think that's something that I've been contemplating a lot over the past year and maybe even beyond that. my career has like taken me in a lot of different places. Had a few reboots and a few low periods.

Dave Byer: So, I mean, just to give a little bit of background, I've, I've worked as a video editor at ESPN for six years. I've worked in programming at, uh, A MC Networks and Warner Brothers, and I've worked, uh, as a TV lit assistant at an agency and done some development work at, at a [00:09:00] few other smaller production companies.

Dave Byer: And, I think finding my own context is something that I've been kind of pursuing my whole career. Like, I've had a goal in mind, but I don't think that it has been something where you can just look at and say, like, if I just do this, then I'll get there, then I'll get there. I've tried to move toward the goal. And sometimes that's been with a lateral move or a diversion or a total, throw something out and hope it, hope it works out kind of thing. I think a, a lot of where I'm at right now is, is kind of trying to make a clearer answer to that question. 

Kate McLeod: Yeah. Is having a goal in mind, does that feel like enough for you to move forward?

Dave Byer: Uh, to be honest, not anymore. I think, because of how windy and unpredictable things have been that, um, I've kind [00:10:00] of tried to expand the goal or, or re-envision the goal, uh, in a way that I think I've hoped would, would make it more possible to get somewhere comfortable. but I don't know that that's worked.

Dave Byer: So that's been part of what I think I've been, um, struggling with in, in kind of reframing goals and success and what that feels like. 

Kate McLeod: So the goal is changing based off the experience that you're having arriving to said goal? 

Dave Byer: Yeah, I would say that. And, um, I wanted to, to kind of say also when we were, we were talking about my path, that a lot of my, outside actual life stuff has definitely impacted the, the journey as well.

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. And, you know, I'm a, I'm a father now of a young daughter, and that definitely changes like your brain chemistry for like what you're willing to, Risk or [00:11:00] put up with, or, you start looking, you know, way down the line a lot more, I think. Yeah. Than, than in the moment, which is what I used to do.

Kate McLeod: what I hear in that is your, you know, 'cause from evidence which we have, which is you having a very diverse career, going to a lot of different places, right? And acquiring A multidisciplinary skillset. Mm-hmm. to me the shape of that is kind of like windy and expansive. and with that in mind, I assume that there are things of your past positions you've had in your career that you're very proud of, and then with things like family stuff changing and becoming a dad like that still is the same direction of expansiveness. And so for me, if I measure backwards hearing what you're saying, it sounds like this is actually the best route for you to arrive at places you wanna be because you're acquiring the whole time.

Dave Byer: Yeah, I mean, I think there's a lot in what you just said that I, I've had to reflect on more. I feel like I've grown a lot [00:12:00] mentally, especially in the last few years, like starting around the pandemic. Um, not afraid to say like I started doing therapy and, working on myself in that and getting better organized, better, like stress management and all that has all led to.

Dave Byer: Being able to learn more, whether it's just kind of within the field, like you were saying, or reading more, learning about topics that I find interesting. So I do feel like acquiring and growing is something that matters a lot to me and it's something that I've always tried to do at all of those different stops.

Dave Byer: And now do even more like outside of work too. 

Kate McLeod: Yeah. I think it's a good pattern to implement into mm-hmm. All sectors of your life. Yeah. especially 'cause you're a lifelong learner. Mm-hmm. Like you've been committed to that and that's very clear in knowing you. Yeah. 

Dave Byer: I've heard you say in your, in the pod that you're a curious person.

Dave Byer: And I would [00:13:00] say that's what I feel too. Like, I like learning about other people that I meet and at large learning about other cultures and other people and other histories and things, around the world that interest me that that's the kind of thing that really sparks my, curiosity. 

Kate McLeod: Yeah. Well, I, I usually think of ideas or things that I learn, like anything education wise, I think of it as, um, like a picture.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. And then I think if you don't ask the why, that the picture remains in the frame. And so if you ask the why you take off the frame so you actually get the entire picture and not just like one little point that might be the most attractive or might be the thing most offered, because when meeting people, you have to acclimate so it's not like you meet someone and you're like, here I am. Mm-hmm. It's, you meet someone and you kind of have to suss it out because everyone's just trying to acclimate the best that they can to every given circumstance. 

Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: But, I like that you picked up on the curiosity thing, 'cause I know that that's definitely a common theme for you.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. my next [00:14:00] question for you is, what feels like it's working for you right now? 

Dave Byer: I'd say that kind of self-reflective growth that I mentioned, like I, I can see, I, I think part of what's been frustrating about being unemployed right now is that I can see that I'm like the best version of myself right now.

Dave Byer: Yeah. Like I've, I've become a smarter person, a more caring person, a more inquisitive person, a more creative person, a more organized person, and all that goes with that, both in my like personal life and professional life. And, uh, I think that regardless of any results that that does or doesn't lead to, like, it's a worthwhile thing to have improved myself like that.

Dave Byer: Uh, and so I feel proud of that growth and happy with. The version of myself that I am and am becoming. 

Kate McLeod: [00:15:00] Mm-hmm. that's important. Mm-hmm. Like everyone at some point in time needs time, whether it's forced upon them or they figure out a way to make it for themselves. I think that there has to be time for an expansiveness.

Kate McLeod: because as you're expanding, you become a different person. So you can't expect to be in the same place that you were before as a different person. Mm-hmm. A different person requires like a different environment. 

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: And so do you, if you are looking backwards, do you think that everything has worked out in the best way for you?

Kate McLeod: Or are there things that you still are like, nah. 

Dave Byer: the thing that I would say I haven't had the growth on that I, I do come back to a lot with that question is, is regret. Like, because of what I've learned to this point and what I've seen, uh, it's easy to look back at a lot of those different stops that I've had on that journey.

Dave Byer: And second, guess what, uh, I know you, you talk about younger Kate a lot. Yeah. So young, younger Dave and the, the thoughts and the steps that he took and wishing that [00:16:00] he went left instead of right here mm-hmm. Kind of thing. you know, some of that I think I, I could have controlled and some of it I couldn't.

Dave Byer: the other kind of stuff that, I was alluding to with my, personal life, like. Kind of bad beats. Uh, my wife got diagnosed with breast cancer at her 30th birthday. Oh, sorry. And that was like right in the period of time when I think I was looking to make like, professional changes, but that was a pretty big, side swipe, uh, kind of reset to plans.

Dave Byer: And then like a few years later, uh, I ended up having like heart failure myself. My God. So, so, um, that's been like two pretty big kind of diversions from what your goals are that you have to kind of, uh, adapt to. And that we're very surprising I think, to both of us. Um, but I think, you know, has made us more resilient.

Dave Byer: but, you know, changed [00:17:00] plans changed, realities that way. So, um, yeah, those are. Some of the things that, you know, when you look back, like the professional choices, I definitely can think twice about, but the, the personal things is like, I think we did pretty good all, all things considered, you know?

Kate McLeod: Yeah. Well, I mean, that sounds like you played the hand, that you were dealt the way that you needed to, and that's mm-hmm. I mean, when anything comes into your life like that, it deserves space in order for it to be what it's gonna be, and then for you to move on past that. Right. Wow. I did not know that.

so with all that, you've kind of covered this, but is there anything else that you would say to my question if I were to ask, what are you working on right now? 

Dave Byer: I think with my, lack of, steady work right now, I've just tried to work on myself a lot when I'm at home. And I think that has led to me being like a better husband and father, which has been honestly like the [00:18:00] most rewarding thing. That's probably a little cliche to like, say, but really that's, I don't think so. That's, that's been, warming my heart.

Dave Byer: Like yesterday wasn't, wasn't a great day. At the end of the day, my kid was like so clingy in a good way and really like lifted my spirits. Um, but then like aside from that stuff, I've been writing more in a, in a way that I really struggled to in the earlier part of my career. It was always something that was on the back burner.

Dave Byer: When I just get this next opportunity, I'll have more time to do it, blah, blah, blah. A lot of excuses, but, that was the way my mindset worked. And now I, I don't write as much as I wish and some of our, our mutual friends do. Mm-hmm. But I, I do make time for it and have every year for the last five, like written three or four scripts, and that is something that I feel good about.

Dave Byer: and then [00:19:00] aside from that, like I put a lot of my effort into, into J-H-R-T-S and in recent months I've found some opportunities for some like, industry gig work or helping with, festivals and things like that. So try to stay, you know, in the mix. 

Kate McLeod: that all sounds like literally the smartest, to me, the smartest thing that you can be doing.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. Because you and I have talked about this so much, and I wanna talk about this. The industry is, we we're in the overhaul. It's changing. Everything's different. Yeah. So for, even though it's unfortunate circumstances to, uh, depends on your perspective, but being unemployed is not fun. Usually 

Dave Byer: Uhhuh, right.

Kate McLeod: for you to use that time for you to basically figure out who you are, like get super in tune and super comfortable in like your own expansion, like who you are, what you have to offer, what you want to make. So you're changing while the industry is changing, and then you're networking so that you're gonna know a ton of people.

Kate McLeod: I mean, that's only gonna [00:20:00] work. Networking only works to your advantage. Networking is also expansive. It just seems like you're participating in all of the literal and energetic things that you need to be, because that's what's gonna continue happening, just when that other thing clicks into place.

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. I, I, I hope so. That's like, kind of been the goal, I think, as time continues to pass with. Looking, uh, and feeling like you are doing all of those things and that it, they are the right moves, it does become like more frustrating that you're not, seeing the traction for that. Mm-hmm. Uh, or the, the return on that, like time and mental investment.

Dave Byer: And I think that, it definitely, you know, is frustrating and also just wears you down, to be frank, like I, you know, at this point have put out so many applications, had so many interviews and, and, just, you know, don't know what it takes to get over that hump. and a [00:21:00] lot of times, you know, those come with, you know, referrals or people passing along your resume and it's still, Isn't always enough. But I, I had somebody yesterday who I knew tell me that, like a job that I applied for at her company had like 500 applicants in a week or whatever. And it's like, that's an insane number. I, I have a lot of confidence in who I am and who I've become, but like, I don't know if I'm the best of 500 people, you know.

Kate McLeod: being the best is relative. Mm-hmm. And being their best is political. Sure. Yeah. that sounds to me a lot like acting. Oh my god, that sounds so much like acting. Um, okay, so this is the, these are the rules of the question. Your answer is correct a hundred percent. And it exists. The answer that you say exists.

Kate McLeod: So if you got to name. Like give a title to and give a description to the ideal role that you are perfect for the perfect candidate. What is the [00:22:00] description, even if that description doesn't exist, even if that name doesn't exist; What is the job that you write that is perfect for you? 

Dave Byer: Um, well, can I ask you a question back? Yeah, 

Kate McLeod: totally. 

Dave Byer: So when we were talking about goals before, like are you asking what would I be ready for tomorrow now? Or like, what would be the end line goal that I would still be shooting for? 

Kate McLeod: okay, great count-.

Kate McLeod: I guess they 

Dave Byer: could be, yeah, they, they would probably be different right now is why I said Oh, is they would be different. Okay. 

Kate McLeod: Because I think that for me. I'm building an empire over here. That's what I'm trying to do. Okay. You know, and I want to be a part of the change because I believe that my ideas are really good uhhuh, and I believe that my mindset is really good.

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: Um, so I wanna be influential of the way to empower other people to be influential. And so if I had to name my job title, it would kind of encompass all of that. But I would know that that is the job title that would grow because I would never [00:23:00] pick an end point. I would always pick a point that continues to get bigger, because that's my favorite thing to do.

Mm-hmm. 

Dave Byer: I love the, the, like the confidence and the outlook. I think, I think we have a lot in common of like our, our outlook on things. But I think that I can tell that you have the like performance background because you're so, you're so comfortable in that kind of like declaration of, of your intent.

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. And that's something that I know I struggle with. Like I don't, I don't feel like I can declare what I think I could do tomorrow, even though I know I could do it. Just 'cause I don't think that other people would believe that I could. And that, that's actually part of why I've, I've tried to learn from you more about the, like, entrepreneurial side because I, I think I've put so much effort [00:24:00] into trying to prove myself to fit into like, corporate boxes that I wish I could just kind of like make my own box, you know, and like, or not a box really.

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. Just like that's really, I think at this point, the only way to prove that I can do what I know I can do. Yeah. Because I feel like I'm so far behind on like a traditional corporate ladder, kind of a sense that it's like, it's, that's why it's caught me up to, to try to answer that question.

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. But I can, I can go back and try to answer it more than that. Well, no, 

Kate McLeod: I mean, I, I will, yes. I want you to, I just, I just wanna say something about what you just said, which is, um, for me, I know I don't work well for people. Mm. I work really well with people. Mm. And so I've just learned that starting out as an actor and realizing what that system looks like and knowing how hard the game is, but also knowing that even if I achieve actor, big movie star in every single movie, [00:25:00] I'm not gonna be creatively satiated because that's only one aspect of me.

Kate McLeod: So, like you, I've expanded and I've realized how multidimensional I am, and so how a lot of stuff needs to be satisfied. And there's only one Kate McLeod, so I'm the one who kind of needs to write what that looks like and invent the spaces, and it is hard to get people to believe what you do. 

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: Um, I told someone.

Kate McLeod: I forget where I was, but it was someone who definitely, I call 'em suits when it's like, you're not in my my world, kind of, but you know, and that's okay. I'm always very interested in what they do and what their perception is. But I said, I was a creative entrepreneur and he says, that sounds made up. And I said, it is.

Kate McLeod: I made it up. Maybe other people have that title. But I think just that ownership of not trying to convince others because I'm never going to, 

right. 

Kate McLeod: Um, maybe that's the middle child in me, or I, I'm not, I'm not sure, but just, I've never successfully been able to convince other people of my opinions, but I've been able to empower them to have their own 

Dave Byer: right.

Kate McLeod: And so usually when people don't believe what [00:26:00] I say, I think that's more of a reflection on them than it is on me because I believe what I say. 

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: And that's what I just wanna say that in response to what you just said. 'cause it is, but it's really, it's hard. Yeah. I think it's really requires a lot of delusion.

Kate McLeod: I think. 

Dave Byer: Well, yeah. That, that's the interesting thing though, is that I, I think when we, we talked about like regrets and things, like, I think when I started my journey in this industry, um, I think if you, if you'd asked me when I was coming out of undergrad, like the same question you just did mm-hmm. I probably would've like whispered on the side.

Dave Byer: Like, I would love to, to be a writer, but I had it kind of like beaten into me through tough professors and other things. I'd heard that like that's, you know, an unstable career path. So I think what my goal was, was to kind of get like a corporate ladder thing that's [00:27:00] still tangential in the industry that would touch some of those like creative, aspects, but like give more stability and more of a pathway to follow rather than like just kind of being desperate all the time or trying and failing. And what I've found is that that is still the case on the corporate ladder too. So like sometimes I do wonder, would it have been better to just kind of go all out in, in pursuit of the, the farfetched version of the dream versus like a, what, what I thought was a safer path mm-hmm.

Dave Byer: But is not safer because of corporate mergers and layoffs and all of everything else that's happened in the last 20 years. 

Kate McLeod: Well, I think that that's the answer is exactly what you just said, which is.

Kate McLeod: You can't go back and change the past. Right. But you can use that information in evidence in your own way. Mm-hmm. And you get to write how that evidence works. So [00:28:00] to the professor who wasn't a writer or who knows, maybe tried to have tried to be a writer and it didn't work, and the person who ultimately wants to keep you safe is gonna say, that's not stable.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. Because to them that's true. But to you, that's not true. And you know that. Mm-hmm. And so I think that that would actually be a tool with those things. And I think about that with Little Kate a lot, is I would use that as tools to say, well this information that I have from the past, yes. I can't change it.

Kate McLeod: And like, yes, I wish I would've started acting earlier. Yes, I wish I would've said yes to this contract when I didn't say yes at the time. But instead, I can look at that information and decide that it's actually gonna be evidence and supporting that I should trust my gut now. 

Mm. Mm-hmm.

Dave Byer: No, I, I, that sounds like good advice. I don't, I don't know what else to say back to that. No, you don't have to respond to that. 

Kate McLeod: I just, um, I, I'm kind of just reflecting on that too. 'cause, you know, something I love about having these kinds of conversations is it's practice. Right? It's practice for both people.

Kate McLeod: And because you've given me tons of good [00:29:00] advice too. Mm-hmm. It's, it's, it's a practice of, um, a neurological pathway that I'd rather subscribe to mm-hmm. As opposed to the older one. So. Right. And, you know, when you spoke about your daughter, my sister-in-law said something to me, 'cause, you know, I expressed to her, I was like, I'm, I'm scared about when to start my family because I'm so protective of my career and I have so much fun doing this.

Kate McLeod: And, and she said, no, no, no, no. She goes, there is nothing like the love of a child or having a child that will make you fight harder. Mm. Because it's not just about you anymore. Mm-hmm. And she's like, it's actually more of a strength than I think that people have told you. It is. Yeah. And with someone who I know so well, that conviction is there, you know, and I see with her how she encourages her kids, like my nephew and my niece.

Kate McLeod: And I, I know the same is true for you as a dad, I can tell. But this, all this self work, it feels like a lot of it is, is it's bigger now because it's not just for you. 

Dave Byer: Yeah, for sure. And I [00:30:00] think that's good advice that she gave. I think that is true. Like it, like I said, it does rewire the brain chemistry, um, in a lot of ways.

Dave Byer: And I think, you know, the fighting harder part is definitely part of it. And, and the kind of like having some aspect to come back to that brings you joy even in like tough times when mm-hmm. Not just, you know, professionally, but in all the other shit going on in the world. Like it's, uh, it's nice to, to have that, um.

Dave Byer: Recommend, 

Kate McLeod: recommend. I mean, I, I'm, I'm excited. The, the 3D life of it all. I, what you said brought up a question for me. do you ever do an exercise where you find your own definition of words?

Dave Byer: It sounds like something I would do. I think I've probably recently, but I, I can't, draw on an example 

Kate McLeod: I think that we all communicate via whatever spoken language we speak. English for us. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. 

Dave Byer: But 

Kate McLeod: I also [00:31:00] think that that is just the common language.

Kate McLeod: It's not the interpersonal one. Mm-hmm. Um, which is why I always ask people, especially when we're working together, what's your context? I always ask people when they say things, I'm like, what is the definition of that word? Because yes, we have what we've agreed upon. For communication's sake.

Kate McLeod: Um, but not in terms of us individually and we don't spend a ton of time on things like that as a community because, we just, I think that the, it's more important to double down on the understanding that everyone will have a different definition of things. But when I was going through your, LinkedIn and I was going through your history of what it is that you've done professionally, I was kind of wondering what a couple of your definitions are for you.

Kate McLeod: Themes I noticed in your work were words like development, assistant coordinator, manager. Earlier we said like curator. Mm-hmm. All these things, all of them have a common thread, but what is your definition of what it means to. Participate in being a part of [00:32:00] making something in your field?

Dave Byer: I can't remember actually if we were talking about this off mic before, or, or on mic, but we were talking about how we both had, a lot of creator energy, even back in school and being like fidgety and, and kind of thinking about other things than the class that we were in.

Dave Byer: And, and I think that's kind of the way I, always was and that I've tried to bring into, my professional positions is just like an idea person. I have tried everywhere I've been to make things better, whether that's in the product that I'm working on, like what's going to air, or even in some of these bigger corporations like.

Dave Byer: Internally, organizationally, I've worked on, career development programs at one of 'em and, fixed like, kind of cumbersome training processes and, and tried to put [00:33:00] together, collaboration between departments that weren't talking to each other, but were doing the same kind of thing and kind of stream streamlining.

Dave Byer: Like that's stuff that I like to do. And I think that's kind of a common thread I see that I think runs through the words that you were just talking about is like trying to help improve things. Development that's like what that word means to me is developing something from a point A to a, a better point B.

Mm-hmm. 

Dave Byer: Uh, whether that's like someone's script or whether that's like the internal. Organizational streamlining I was talking about, 

Kate McLeod: I just got a visual of, um, and this is the bad pitch visual, but I got a visual of your ideal job being the idea a house. Mm-hmm. 

Dave Byer: Like 

Kate McLeod: the, like the, like, no, like the idea, not like, yeah.

Kate McLeod: House or like, I just saw you in front of a big building and it was just an ideas on it. But would that be, I like it. The, would that be the ideal job then to be the [00:34:00] ideas person? Because making things better, it makes things, I feel like I've said this like 90 times this episode, but expansive. 

Dave Byer: Yeah. You 

Kate McLeod: know, so you want to make things bigger, better.

Dave Byer: Yeah. I mean that, that, I think I would love that sort of thing. It, it just comes back to what I said before about the kind of like imposter syndrome feel of it all. Like I know I would be good at that. Mm-hmm. But, um, I don't know that I've like proven it in any way that. Say, I say I did have that as like a, a business or something.

Dave Byer: Like, why would someone come to me for that? Just like, what, what do I have to like, demonstrate or prove my idea house is not gonna blow over in a wind, you know, Uhhuh, 

Kate McLeod: Okay. Then build it brick by brick. do you ever count, like the things that you have done that have been successful, do you ever look at evidence?

Kate McLeod: Do you ever, like, it's like rereading a book, right? Mm-hmm. And like seeing what you didn't see before. Mm. So you go back, maybe you do like an audit of literally your career [00:35:00] and be like, Nope, this was good. And then you write it out, because our brains are super tricky. They want us to keep, stay in the, can I write that?

Kate McLeod: Yeah, please. Please Build it back. Write it down. Yeah. Um, our brains are so tricky. The safest place is the place where we're not dead. Which is where we are right now. Mm-hmm. Because I have proof to you right now that I am chilling here. Mm-hmm. I'm doing okay. Mm-hmm. But to think that I'm gonna go somewhere different, I don't know what that is.

Kate McLeod: The unknown. Right. And thematically, it sounds like you're talking about a lot of things that sound like they oh my gosh, I just lost my thought. No, no, no, I didn't. Ugh. I hate it when this happens to me. I get like so excited about a big idea and I'm like, wait, where did it go?

Kate McLeod: Oh, but you build it brick by brick. You basically go back. Your audit is where have I been successful? Where have I made this idea better? And okay, now I remember my thought. Our brains don't want us to realize that because then it is going to give us momentum to get bigger and to start making these bigger ideas and like changing our whole trajectory or changing our lives or changing things up, going to the new [00:36:00] place.

Kate McLeod: It is helpful. I do this a lot in my, ME³ program. you have a modality of how you track your evidence, how you, put your evidence down. You write it out, you do a voice memo, you turn your phone on, you face time record yourself or whatever, whatever it is that you future self is gonna believe from past you.

Kate McLeod: Mm. But that starts with going back first and being like, what evidence do I already have here? It's like instead of going out to dinner, it's like seeing what's in the fridge. 

You 

Kate McLeod: know? There's always food at home. Yeah. Okay. So you were to go back and be like, no, I have the evidence. I write this down.

Kate McLeod: 'cause then you're gonna have nine pages that'll be sitting in front of you and you're like, holy shit. The idea house is like the best idea ever. 

Dave Byer: Hmm. Yeah. No, that's interesting because like, even just you talking about it and, and me having to kind of recount some of it to you is Like reminding me maybe to value some things that I've done more than I like, kind of even was primed to.

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. Uh, I think when you're in, when you're in a spot, especially in [00:37:00] a corporate position for a while, which like I've been at some for two years, some for one of them for six. And like it sounds long, but while you're in it, it just kind of passes really fast and you Yeah. All of a sudden they've been there a long time and like stuff becomes so road almost that you kind of like forget that you did these things that might be impressive or might be, um, you know, a brick for something else.

Kate McLeod: Yeah. I have a section in my notes app on my phone, and it's just call, I call it universal winks. Mm-hmm. You know, that's my thing. And I just write down things that are proof of e evidence. Yeah. Of what it is I'm doing. Mm-hmm. Because then when I have those moments when I go down, which I give myself space for when I'm super down or not feeling a hundred percent confident, then I let myself have that space.

Kate McLeod: But then when I've had my time there and really felt those emotions, which are just as valid as the other ones mm-hmm. That I pull out my universal winks and I go through my evidence bank [00:38:00] and I'm like, okay, 

Dave Byer: evidence bank. I like that. Yeah. 

Kate McLeod: Like, I'm glad I have that. That's great. And I have to be honest, I mean this is a, what a lot of creative entrepreneurship has been for me, is it's figuring out the best way to introduce myself to the world.

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: And so I will admit that one of my plans on having you on the podcast is I believe in you tremendously, and I've seen your work ethic and I've seen what I believe that you're capable of and I think it should be shared with the world. 

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. And 

Kate McLeod: so it's like, I think that having platforms where you find creative ways to introduce yourself to people, whether it be podcasts or whatever, but instead of a resume being the definition of who you are and what your value is, why can't there be a larger body of work?

Kate McLeod: That is, why can't it be what you say about yourself or how you talk about yourself or how you interact with another person. Mm-hmm. Like instead of maybe the energy that you have in the past put towards caring about what other people think. Mm-hmm. Maybe that energy that is meant for other people, you decide to redirect it towards engaging with others.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. Or participating with others. Mm-hmm. Instead of [00:39:00] caring what they think in terms of putting yourself down, you care what they think in terms of expanding yourself. 

Mm. Mm-hmm. 

Dave Byer: I think, I feel like that's something that I've. gotten better at, um, when you said that it was making me kind of reflect on, on some of the different relationships over the past, uh, five, 10 years of networking and, I think, I think I've, I've done some of that, but it does, it is hard when you're, when you're in a job, I, I think it's almost easier when you're talking to people outside of where you work that to do some of that.

Dave Byer: And when you're, when you're in it, it gets lost in the, you know, day to day minutia of like, you know, seeing someone at their desk and bumping into them in the cafeteria or whatever. It, it becomes, so, um, it, gets absorbed by the mundanity of the every day. But, but it's good to reframe it that way and think of it that way if, you are in that context.

Kate McLeod: Yeah. Well, I think those systems also have hierarchies. Mm. Mm-hmm. And so it's [00:40:00] like a lot of that is wanting to stay safe. Mm-hmm. Because when you're working in a system, which I would argue for my perspective doesn't work, right. Um, it's like, yeah, you're trying to stay safe and stay small and it helps you be more digestible to other people.

Kate McLeod: And that's typically what does keep you okay in those frames. 

Dave Byer: Yeah. Yeah. I think, I think that you're pointing out something else that I am noticing with that, like, that hierarchy is not always a fan of those, uh, idea house bricks for what I'll mm-hmm. How we'll call it like, uh, you know, people sometimes like the, the old ways and the, the traditional hierarchy, even if.

Dave Byer: You can tell it's not working or could be done better. Um, so that like idea that I shared of, or what I said before about wanting to kind of help improve things, not everyone's always on that wavelength and I [00:41:00] think that is why, you know, you and perhaps I probably are better suited for, for independent, uh, work because of that.

Dave Byer: Yeah. So something else to think about. 

Kate McLeod: Well, I think it's also being the good hearted person, right? And it's also actually desiring change that's not wanting to fit into some math that's already been written by someone else. I'm not really interested in taking someone else's journey 'cause I don't think I could ever successfully be someone else.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. So it's really about writing my own and yeah. I, I would agree for both of us, independence is better. Mm-hmm. Because I, I don't want the other system just 'cause someone else vetted it. Right. I want the system that I vet because, I mean, how many people's opinions do you genuinely trust? 

Dave Byer: Right. Yeah, I mean, I, I've ran into a lot of stuff at a couple of the companies where people would literally say things like, well, we had to do it this way, so you should too.

Dave Byer: And it's like, uh, well that's a pretty awful reason to continue doing something, [00:42:00] especially when just the framing of that is like a negative, you know, like, we had to do this, we had to, did you though? No, you didn't. You chose to, oh, we could do better. So why don't we try? 

Kate McLeod: So what, what would your definition of laziness be then?

Dave Byer: What would my definition of laziness be? Um. Well, I mean, the status quo, I guess like in, unless the status quo, I mean, there are status quos that are probably working well and you should stick with. Yeah. But for the most part, like just seeing something not working and just kind of going with it, just because like that's, that irritates me.

Kate McLeod: Yeah. Yeah. 'cause that that decision, um, or like common mentality that people buy into of just loss of their own autonomy. 

Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: To think that you don't have your own autonomy anywhere is crazy because it's like even in a puzzle, there's a thousand piece puzzle.

Kate McLeod: There are a thousand pieces that fit together altogether one way, but each one still has their own image. 

Dave Byer: [00:43:00] Hmm. True. Yeah. And, um. I think a lot of that comes also from like, you know, change seems hard, but like a lot of the times the way I look at it is people think the status quo or staying without something is, is easier.

Dave Byer: But when you think about it on a lot of these cases where there were, you know, cumbersome processes, it's like this status quo is actually taking everyone longer to accomplish work. And if we spend a little bit of time on reforming this process, like actually the change will be easier for everyone, but mm-hmm.

Dave Byer: I don't, I don't really know why not everyone sees things that way. Mm-hmm. But, um, glad that I do, even though it doesn't always please everybody. 

Kate McLeod: Well, the, the status quo to me seems like the ai Right. That seems like the artificial intelligence. Hmm. And that seems like the thing that we've just decided doesn't grow anymore.

Kate McLeod: Right. And I, I hate. [00:44:00] Like when things are not innovative, I don't want them to say the same. And yeah, change is hard. Like, that's just like a fact, like change is just not fun. Um, always I think hard can be fun. but to choose something else because you're afraid. The other thing is hard to me that's like, oh man, like I feel like you just made yourself smaller.

Kate McLeod: Right. Instead of making yourself bigger and like Yeah, for sure. There are times that you don't need to, but it's like missing out on an opportunity to grow. It's like missing a meal. Mm-hmm. You know, as a kid when you're trying to build bones and shit. Yeah. I'm curious about how you would define your creative voice, because to me a lot of what you've done in the past seems very conduit driven.

Kate McLeod: Very, um, not siphoning, but I wanna say Like the example of having a big body of work that you are gonna put into a hook. 

Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: Or when you're saying, you know, let's take these ideas and let's make them make sense so then they can get bigger, you know, where it's just like the little connections Yeah.

Kate McLeod: Um, that happen between people. How would you [00:45:00] define your creative voice when you are able to translate creativity from one place to another? 

Dave Byer: Um, I, the, the best example I can think of for where that resonates is, is that we talked earlier about, uh, regret and not being able to go backwards. But I think a lot of those things that I've tried to use my creative voice to create or improve, have been in a way to try to.

Dave Byer: Correct missteps I've had, but for other people. So like in one of those jobs when I worked on training, it was because when I was being trained, the process was not good. So I wanted the people after me to have a better time than I did with it. Yeah. Um, with the, the thing I'm like most proud of in the recent years is with J-H-R-T-S making the, uh, [00:46:00] New York Writers Room.

Dave Byer: That was something that I saw a lot of creatives in our membership that wanna be writers and all these opportunities are like primarily in Los Angeles and there's no. Pipeline. There's no, there's a lot less opportunity here, but there's still a ton of people wanting to make it here. So I went through the process of like pitching and conceiving and working on implementing that with someone else who had firsthand writer's room experience and then got people to participate and give, uh, advice that were East Coast based or non LA people, uh, to give, you know, their journeys into the, into writing.

Dave Byer: And, and I wanted to create that opportunity bec not just for me, but for other people. And so I guess that's how I kind of view my creative voice is like trying [00:47:00] to help not just myself. I would love for our industry to be like more inclusive, not just of like gender and. Race and sexual orientation, but geography, like, to me, that's such a huge thing.

Dave Byer: Like not everyone can afford to take a chance on moving to the second most expensive city in our country. So like, do we not think there are good storytellers in Detroit or New Orleans or Jacksonville, Florida or whatever. Like, I just wish there was more like opportunity for people outside of la. 

Kate McLeod: I think that means including accessibility and opportunity.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And I think that people think that's hard. 

Yeah. 

Kate McLeod: And then they don't want to. 

Yeah. 

Kate McLeod: And doing something like that, that would be hard, would be fantastic. Mm-hmm. it sounds like for me with you that learning actually needs teaching [00:48:00] involved in it in order for it to be learning. And earlier you said that you have two parents who are teachers. Mm-hmm. And because you're saying that, you know, you learn this stuff, you think of a better way, you're like, ah, it could have been taught better. Mm-hmm. So then it does change, and then you teach it.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. And then you left that place better. But you hope that the energy that you put there actually continues that the next person, even though that they, they learn from you, they go, yeah, that was great. Mm-hmm. I could teach it better once I put this on it. Mm-hmm. Like, they keep evolving it. 

Dave Byer: Yeah.

Dave Byer: That would be, great to kind of see that in your, in your wake. And it, I think another reason why I am so proud of the, the writer's room is that it has, I've already seen that happen. Like we've done two now and like five members of our board are former people from the room, and I am passing the third version of the room off to two people who came from the room.

Dave Byer: So they're doing like, literally what you said, they're gonna run it now and hopefully make it better. And that feels good to me to, like, I love being a part of it, [00:49:00] but I, I feel good that it'll continue and hopefully evolve beyond me. 

Kate McLeod: Okay. Wait, now I have a real question. Not a real, they're all real.

Kate McLeod: I have a big question. Uhhuh, What is the difference between the ego of the past for you and the ego in the future? 

Dave Byer: I've looked up the definition of those, like psych terms so many times I never like really retained them.

Dave Byer: So, 

Kate McLeod: what I'm hearing you say is that you're saying that you hope that it gets better from where you left it uhhuh. So why don't you think that whatever you do next, you're going to make better?

Dave Byer: Oh, I, I, I feel like I would. Yeah. But like, yeah, it's just a matter of like, getting that opportunity or creating that opportunity. 

Kate McLeod: you already have the pattern that you do uhhuh. There's no ego. You say, yeah, I, I did. Here I, this could have been better. I want that to be better.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. I hope you make it better. 

Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: But then it's a thing of like waiting for permission in order for you to make a space better when really you already are. Mm-hmm. And like, yes, it's in [00:50:00] JHRTS, like while you are looking for the next opportunity. But I think that it goes a long way when you have that confidence and you believe that in yourself, like people believe you when you believe yourself because you believing in yourself, is literally the instruction manual for other people to believe you. 

Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: You can't expect people to do what you haven't already done for yourself. 

Right. 

Kate McLeod: I just see it. You already have it there. 

Okay. 

Kate McLeod: That's awesome. Not, I mean, I think it's a big thing to say, Hey, I've been here and I made this better, but you're also by you saying that you hope someone else makes it better, it's either that you know that you're not the one who makes the best version, that who makes the best version is a lot of people together.

Sure. 

Kate McLeod: And it's also you saying I hope that my expansion continues to expand. 

Dave Byer: Mm-hmm. Yeah. I mean, I. I guess, yeah, when I hear the word ego, I do think of like kind of a narcissism as what I associate that word with. [00:51:00] So like, no, I, I don't think that I'm probably ever the best version I would want to, like, I, like you said, like I said before, like improve things and assume that there's always going to be room for more improvement.

Yeah. 

Dave Byer: You're never at the, the end point of something. There's always a way to make it better. 

Kate McLeod: A common thing I, I hear on podcasts, um, when CEOs are on podcasts that I follow, a lot of them say, be the solution to someone's problem. And that's the same way I feel about acting when I come in. Like, I don't know, because it's personal for me to say that I am the best version of this.

Kate McLeod: It's political for you to say that my thing is the best version for this. Right. But for you to develop your own idea and then bring it to someone and say, this is my solution to your problem. 

Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: When it comes to getting employed by somebody who, like, there are 500 applicants, you [00:52:00] know, I think that there is value in being able to say, yeah, there are 500 applicants.

Kate McLeod: I'm telling you that I'm the best one. 

Mm-hmm. 

Kate McLeod: Because I'm the best version of myself right now because I'm gonna come in and I will be a solution to your problem. I know that I for a fact will make this a better place and I will set it up to be a better place so the next person makes it a better place.

Kate McLeod: So I'm not your temporary solution, I'm your long-term. 

Dave Byer: I think that's a good way to frame it and I, I would love to be able to work next on like harnessing the, the sort of confidence energy that, that you radiate and, and get some of that myself. Mm-hmm. Um, yeah, I, I think. When you, when you compared what I was saying to the, the acting, it, it clicked for me also that, that like writing is that too, like if you're writing a script that you want to sell or pitch, like you're thinking your script is a solution to [00:53:00] some sort of lack, there is on TV or on in the theaters.

Dave Byer: Like you think you can fill that hole. Your writing is the solution to that problem too. So there's like a through line there that I didn't really see. 

Kate McLeod: Oh, I like that. Yeah. I, oh, I love that. Well, especially with the theater that's on right now and with what I'm seeing, like there, there's good theater, right?

Kate McLeod: Yeah. There, but there's not, it's not in abundance. Right. I feel like there are pockets of good theater right now. Right. I feel like there are pockets of good TV right now, and I would love for those pockets to expand to other areas. Because the going on autopilot of people and not being authentic, it leads to more of the same that's already existed.

Kate McLeod: And so I just love this theme of expansiveness and not being a temporary solution, but to be a long-term solution by being part of it and knowing that it's gonna continue after you. And that to me, 'cause to me ego is I'm the best. No one can do what I [00:54:00] do. And when I'm not there, you're failing. 

Right.

Kate McLeod: And that's just not you coded at all. Right. Um, I just looked at the time and can't believe how fast this flew. This was, this was so, so fun. Yeah. And thank you so much for being here. 

Dave Byer: Thanks for having me. It was good to, to open up and talk about some of this stuff and I feel, you know, rejuvenated in a way and Oh, 

Kate McLeod: cool.

Kate McLeod: Uh, 

Dave Byer: eager to try some things out. 

Kate McLeod: Yeah. So what, um, is there anything that you wanna say last thoughts, or anything you wanna plug? Like do you want people to follow you anywhere or are there any, you know, are there any lasting thoughts too? Um, 

Dave Byer: I, I have on socials @byerbethere but I don't really care if anyone follows me, follows me.

Dave Byer: Um, but, uh, no, this, this was a lot of fun. I, I like hope to, hope that you can keep helping other people with, with your [00:55:00] initiatives that you're doing and appreciate you sharing, uh, your wisdom and and time with me in the past off mic. And, um, that's been helpful. Thanks. 

Kate McLeod: Oh, well of course. And honestly, I, why I love this is I expand too, you know, I always leave a different person, which is exciting to me 'cause you've shared tons of wisdom with me.

Kate McLeod: Mm-hmm. And what clicks for me in my version of my life and then clicks for you in your version of your life. It's just. So much information and it's like the more information we have mm-hmm. The more we can do with it, more actions we can take. For sure. Yeah. Thanks Dave. 

Dave Byer: Thank you. 

And that's the latest I'm honored to have been part of your thinking sphere today. Feel free to share, like, and subscribe on this platform or follow and participate on any of my social media platforms. If this practice intrigues you as much as it does me, then join us in the ME three community where we will work directly and you'll curate a mindful method of thinking to define your own creative conscious.

Thanks for listening to the latest episode of Authenticated. I love that you're here. [00:56:00]